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NNTP access etc. to FUDforums ? [message #161607] Mon, 18 January 2010 20:10 Go to next message
newbiejohn is currently offline  newbiejohn
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(1) I want to install FUDforums and have access to them via a newsreader i.e. NNTP access. Is that possible ?

If so then could someone here please direct me to somewhere that details what I need to do please ?

(2) I want to mirror FUDforum posts from/to an email list. Is that possible ? If so then could someone here please direct me to somewhere that details what I need to do please ?

(3) I want to mirror FUDforum posts from/to an existing Mailman email list. Is that possible ? If so then could someone here please direct me to somewhere that details what I need to do please ?

Help on any/all of the above appreciated. Smile

Regards, John.
Re: NNTP access etc. to FUDforums ? [message #161608 is a reply to message #161607] Tue, 19 January 2010 01:35 Go to previous messageGo to next message
naudefj is currently offline  naudefj   South Africa
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newbiejohn wrote:
(1) I want to install FUDforums and have access to them via a newsreader i.e. NNTP access. Is that possible ?

If so then could someone here please direct me to somewhere that details what I need to do please ?


Although it won't be too difficult to implement, this is not what FUDforum does. FUDforum will import USENET posts and optionally propagate replies back to the group. So you can either read the group's posts on the forum (browser) or the original group (newsreader). For more details, see Newsgroup Manager.

newbiejohn wrote:
(2) I want to mirror FUDforum posts from/to an email list. Is that possible ? If so then could someone here please direct me to somewhere that details what I need to do please?


Sure, you can simply register a users on the forum with the list's e-mail address and subscribe to the required forums.

newbiejohn wrote:
(3) I want to mirror FUDforum posts from/to an existing Mailman email list. Is that possible ? If so then could someone here please direct me to somewhere that details what I need to do please?


Yes, it can be done. See documentation at Mailing List Manager.
Re: NNTP access etc. to FUDforums ? [message #161616 is a reply to message #161607] Wed, 20 January 2010 22:30 Go to previous messageGo to next message
newbie.john is currently offline  newbie.john
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newbiejohn wrote:

(1) I want to install FUDforums and have access to them via a newsreader i.e. NNTP access. Is that possible ?

If so then could someone here please direct me to somewhere that details what I need to do please ?

>Although it won't be too difficult to implement, this is not what FUDforum does. FUDforum will import USENET posts and optionally propagate replies back to the group. So you can either read the group's posts on the forum (browser) or the original group (newsreader). For more details, see Newsgroup Manager.

Thank you for your reply. What I wanted is to mirror a forum to a "private" newsgroup. Not mirror a usenet newsgroup.

I assume that if I have the private news server address then I can mirror to a FUD web forum so that posts go to/from either/both ?

Newsgroups are far superior to web forums for archiving messages.

Ideally I was hoping that FUD had included it's own NNTP server capability. Does anyone here know if this is being planned please ? Some existing commercial web forum software does allow this. Web forum posts can be accessed via a newsreader.

Thank you for the other two answers. It appears that the "standard" install allows usenet access and email mirroring. Is that correct ?

Regards, John.

Re: NNTP access etc. to FUDforums ? [message #161621 is a reply to message #161616] Thu, 21 January 2010 10:33 Go to previous messageGo to next message
naudefj is currently offline  naudefj   South Africa
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newbie.john wrote:
I assume that if I have the private news server address then I can mirror to a FUD web forum so that posts go to/from either/both ?


Sure you can. FUDforum doesn't care if it's a public or private group.

newbie.john wrote:
Newsgroups are far superior to web forums for archiving messages.


Better than most forums, probably. However, do you really think that it would be better than FUDflorum? If so, I would very much like to understand why you think so.

newbie.john wrote:
Ideally I was hoping that FUD had included it's own NNTP server capability. Does anyone here know if this is being planned please ?


No it's not planned. It will only be included if someone develops the code or sponsors the development of it.

newbie.john wrote:
It appears that the "standard" install allows usenet access and email mirroring. Is that correct ?


Correct. It's a core capability.

Re: NNTP access etc. to FUDforums ? [message #161631 is a reply to message #161621] Thu, 21 January 2010 19:09 Go to previous messageGo to next message
newbie.john is currently offline  newbie.john
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newbie.john wrote:
Newsgroups are far superior to web forums for archiving messages.

naudefj wrote:

Better than most forums, probably. However, do you really think that it would be better than FUDflorum? FUDflorum so, I would very much like to understand why you think so.

newbie.john wrote:

How many days have you got to read my answer ? Newsgroups (if they are private/moderated) are far superior to ANY web forum. Not just FUD.

For a start, in a news post it is absurdly easy to intersperse comments in a previous post. As is so well illustrated by this post it is almost impossible to do that easily in a web forum post. Unless someone is well versed in HTML and/or programming.

Replying to a web forum post might be fine IF one only askes one question at a time. Otherwise "who said what" becomes a mess.

Unless of course one puts all one's comments at the bottom of the post. Which is just plain dopey, as well as inconvenient. A reply that is 50 lines beneath what one is commenting on can create confusion, as one may lose track of "which of the stuff above" is being commented on.

When a news post paragraph is replied to immediately after itself then there is no confusion as to what is being replied to.

Also, if this were a newsgroup and I wanted to download all of the posts then that would be absurdly easy in a newsreader. Downloading thousands of posts in a newsreader would only take me a matter of minutes.

(Can I do that with FUD messages ? I doubt it.)

I would then be able to read all the posts offline. Not everyone in the world has an "allways on" internet connection. Also, what if this server went down, ceased being hosted, or changed address ? With a newsreader I would still be able to read the previous posts.

Also, it is very easy to killfile people in a newsreader. Not so a web forum.

Also, I can easily make a newsreader "view" for such things as "unread messages" or "last 3 days" etc. etc.

So archiving/posting/searching etc. are all very very much easier in a newsreader.

The above is after thinking about your question for about half a minute. I could do a "proper" reply but I doubt that anyone here would be interested.

Lastly, I have one more question regarding the above. If Tom, Dick and Harry posted in a FUD forum that mirrored to an NNTP server then would their posting info be different names eg. Tom, Dick or harry ? Or would all the different posts be a single address eg. "From FUD forum" ?

Thank you for your replies to my queries. They are much appreciated. Smile

Regards, John.
Re: NNTP access etc. to FUDforums ? [message #161646 is a reply to message #161631] Sat, 23 January 2010 16:55 Go to previous messageGo to next message
kerryg is currently offline  kerryg   
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newbie.john wrote on Thu, 21 January 2010 16:09
How many days have you got to read my answer ? Newsgroups (if they are private/moderated) are far superior to ANY web forum. Not just FUD. For a start, in a news post it is absurdly easy to intersperse comments in a previous post. As is so well illustrated by this post it is almost impossible to do that easily in a web forum post. Unless someone is well versed in HTML and/or programming.


Really? I just hit "quote" right now instead of "reply", which gave me everything you posted as text. To answer each phrase, I select it and hit the button marked "quote" to display it as you see. I type my reply; I select the next phrase; I hit "quote" again. Lather, rinse, repeat.

Quote:
Replying to a web forum post might be fine IF one only askes one question at a time. Otherwise "who said what" becomes a mess... Unless of course one puts all one's comments at the bottom of the post. Which is just plain dopey, as well as inconvenient. A reply that is 50 lines beneath what one is commenting on can create confusion, as one may lose track of "which of the stuff above" is being commented on.


That would indeed suck.

Quote:
When a news post paragraph is replied to immediately after itself then there is no confusion as to what is being replied to.


True enough. You've noticed that most of the replies in this thread have comments interspersed?

Quote:
Also, if this were a newsgroup and I wanted to download all of the posts then that would be absurdly easy in a newsreader. Downloading thousands of posts in a newsreader would only take me a matter of minutes.(Can I do that with FUD messages ? I doubt it.)


I've never tried - Frank? Can it do this?

Quote:
Also, I can easily make a newsreader "view" for such things as "unread messages" or "last 3 days" etc. etc.


You noticed the clickable text in the header above which is marked "Unread Messages", "Unanswered Messages" and "Today's Posts", right?

Quote:
So archiving/posting/searching etc. are all very very much easier in a newsreader.


I'm here because the NNTP server I used didn't do it for me. YMMV but I found archiving in a forum format far more convenient. I think what you're really saying is that you prefer NNTP for archiving because its strengths are strengths you require and its weaknesses are weaknesses you don't care about.

Quote:
Lastly, I have one more question regarding the above. If Tom, Dick and Harry posted in a FUD forum that mirrored to an NNTP server then would their posting info be different names eg. Tom, Dick or harry ? Or would all the different posts be a single address eg. "From FUD forum" ?


The posts will show up on the NNTP server with the user name and address they have at the forum.

[Updated on: Sat, 23 January 2010 17:00]

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Re: NNTP access etc. to FUDforums ? [message #161647 is a reply to message #161646] Sat, 23 January 2010 20:11 Go to previous messageGo to next message
newbie.john is currently offline  newbie.john
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kerryg wrote on Sat, 23 January 2010 16:55
newbie.john wrote on Thu, 21 January 2010 16:09
How many days have you got to read my answer ? Newsgroups (if they are private/moderated) are far superior to ANY web forum. Not just FUD. For a start, in a news post it is absurdly easy to intersperse comments in a previous post. As is so well illustrated by this post it is almost impossible to do that easily in a web forum post. Unless someone is well versed in HTML and/or programming.


Quote:
Really? I just hit "quote" right now instead of "reply", which gave me everything you posted as text. To answer each phrase, I select it and hit the button marked "quote" to display it as you see. I type my reply; I select the next phrase; I hit "quote" again. Lather, rinse, repeat.


Okay, that sounds good. I selected your paragraph, and did as you said. Let's see if it looks a mess or not.

Having looked at this in "Preview" it is as I suspected. Better, but still a mess. It is hard to work out which "Quote" is yours and which "Quote" is mine. Once one get's past "immediate" quoting a web forum is terrible.

A newsgroup post however would NOT generally have problems with multiple quoting levels. Indents clearly suggest "who said what". Also, newsreaders can often be setup to show different quoting levels as different colours.

Of course this could be fixed in a web forum BUT I certainly haven't seen it addressed by anyone. The "Quote" button would need additions. Eg.

(1) Insert "quote" tags and name of previous poster.
(2) Insert "quote" tags and name of poster before previous poster.
(3) Insert "quote" tags and name of poster before ... etc.

Of course that would be too wordy so something like..

(1) Insert "quote" tags and name of previous poster.
(2) Insert "quote" tags and name of poster [ ] levels prior.

Might be better than what we have here or the above suggestion.

< snip >

Quote:
Also, if this were a newsgroup and I wanted to download all of the posts then that would be absurdly easy in a newsreader. Downloading thousands of posts in a newsreader would only take me a matter of minutes.(Can I do that with FUD messages ? I doubt it.)

Quote:

I've never tried - Frank? Can it do this?


As an example, I just visited a newsgroup I hadn't known about before. It had over 9,000 posts in it. My newsreader downloaded them all in 16 minutes.

I am pretty certain I could * NOT * download all the messages in the FUD forums to my computer. Which hugely increases the possibility of repeating questions that have been asked before but aren't in a FAQ.

Quote:
Also, I can easily make a newsreader "view" for such things as "unread messages" or "last 3 days" etc. etc.


Quote:
You noticed the clickable text in the header above which is marked "Unread Messages", "Unanswered Messages" and "Today's Posts", right?


Sure, but what if I only want "Unread Messages" for the last 3 days ? Or "Unread Messages" for November ?

Or "Unanswered Messages" from January only ? Or "Unanswered Messages" from November ?

Or "Today's Posts" excluding poster "Fred", "Mary" and "Jane" ? Or "Today's Posts" for "Harry" only ?

I can do all that in a newsreader, and a lot more.

Quote:
So archiving/posting/searching etc. are all very very much easier in a newsreader.


Quote:
I'm here because the NNTP server I used didn't do it for me. YMMV but I found archiving in a forum format far more convenient. < snip >


Well, I have no idea what you mean by "archiving in a forum format". Isn't the FUD forum server where posts are archived ? How can you archive the posts on your computer ?

Quote:
Lastly, I have one more question regarding the above. If Tom, Dick and Harry posted in a FUD forum that mirrored to an NNTP server then would their posting info be different names eg. Tom, Dick or harry ? Or would all the different posts be a single address eg. "From FUD forum" ?


Quote:
The posts will show up on the NNTP server with the user name and address they have at the forum
.

Thank you.


Re: NNTP access etc. to FUDforums ? [message #161651 is a reply to message #161647] Sun, 24 January 2010 02:22 Go to previous messageGo to next message
naudefj is currently offline  naudefj   South Africa
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newbie.john wrote:
I am pretty certain I could * NOT * download all the messages in the FUD forums to my computer. Which hugely increases the possibility of repeating questions that have been asked before but aren't in a FAQ.


There are so many ways to do it it's not even funny. For example:
1) See "Complete Forum Output" in the PDF manager.
2) Install FUDforum2Go on your PC and sync the posts (XML Syndication).
3) Use any of the 1000000 available offline web reader utilities out there.

newbie.john wrote:
Sure, but what if I only want "Unread Messages" for the last 3 days ? Or "Unread Messages" for November ?


Then you click on the "Message Navigator" link just next to it.

newbie.john wrote:
A newsgroup post however would NOT generally have problems with multiple quoting levels. Indents clearly suggest "who said what".


FUDforum will use E-Mail/USENET style quoting if you set the forum's tag style to "none".
Re: NNTP access etc. to FUDforums ? [message #161658 is a reply to message #161651] Sun, 24 January 2010 18:22 Go to previous message
newbie.john is currently offline  newbie.john
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naudefj wrote on Sun, 24 January 2010 02:22
newbie.john wrote:
I am pretty certain I could * NOT * download all the messages in the FUD forums to my computer. Which hugely increases the possibility of repeating questions that have been asked before but aren't in a FAQ.


Quote:
There are so many ways to do it it's not even funny. For example:
1) See "Complete Forum Output" in the PDF manager.


I would be happy to. If I could find such a thing. If I go to the documentation page I see no mention of a "PDF manager" or "Complete Forum Output". A search gives me..

There is no page titled "PDF manager" etc. Is that "documentation" not on the "documentation" page ?

Quote:
2) Install FUDforum2Go on your PC and sync the posts (XML Syndication).


Doesn't install on my windows system. I think it needs XP or higher.

Quote:
3) Use any of the 1000000 available offline web reader utilities out there.


1000000 ? I have only ever heard of one, and that one was reported to work poorly.

If there are so many then perhaps someone here can recommend two or three different ones for me to try out ? Particularly ones that work well with FUD ? Or maybe there is a good web site that lists a bunch of these applications ?

newbie.john wrote:
Sure, but what if I only want "Unread Messages" for the last 3 days ? Or "Unread Messages" for November ?


Quote:
Then you click on the "Message Navigator" link just next to it.


Yes, I just "discovered" that. Not long after making those comments. Thank you. That looks handy.

newbie.john wrote:
A newsgroup post however would NOT generally have problems with multiple quoting levels. Indents clearly suggest "who said what".

Quote:

FUDforum will use E-Mail/USENET style quoting if you set the forum's tag style to "none".


Wow ! That is great. If I can ever work out how to do that then it will be a huge help.

Thank you for your help. FUD looks better day by day. Smile

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