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Re: Windows binaries 64bit for PHP [message #178144 is a reply to message #178139] Mon, 14 May 2012 21:57 Go to previous messageGo to previous message
Jerry Stuckle is currently offline  Jerry Stuckle
Messages: 2598
Registered: September 2010
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On 5/14/2012 5:00 PM, Michael Fesser wrote:
> .oO(Jerry Stuckle)
>
>> On 5/14/2012 10:22 AM, Shake wrote:
>>
>>> [Balancer]
>>>
>>> [httpd] [httpd] [EC2]
>>>
>>> [Mysql*] [Sphinx*]
>>>
>>> [] independent systems.
>>> * And other services
>>>
>>> EC2 Machine does the scaling. Both balanced httpd are ready to process
>>> new incoming petitions. One of them have a process waiting answer from
>>> ec2 and only this one take more time to finish. the "HARD WORK" is done
>>> by auto-scalable EC2 machines.
>>
>> Which actually means nothing. The server is still tied up resizing
>> images, which means it can't do its real job (serving page requests).
>
> Obviously a picture server doesn't serve pages.
>

Nope, but resizing an image requires server resources which can be
better spent elsewhere.

>>> ¿?¿? What you say is the easy way. But ineffective. And waste resources,
>>> A LOT OF THEM. because implies having a few machines for a few days only
>>> doing this work! And also implies a few days without having this work
>>> available online!
>>
>> It is a waste of SERVER resources to force the server to do it! And
>> that is much more critical than workstation resources.
>
> How could a server waste resources by doing the job it is dedicated for?
> Does a database server waste resource by answering SQL requests? If
> there's a server (even a virtual one) dedicated to serve pictures in
> various formats, how could it waste resources by doing exactly that?
>

The server is made for serving requests. Resizing images is not
necessary for serving the request, if the correct image size has been
uploaded already.

Having to have a special server just to serve images in different sizes
should tell you how much server load is being wasted!

And your question about SQL is completely unrelated. I will ignore it.

>>> The images have to be resizes yes or yes. You thought that "the server"
>>> is only a http server. For me the server "do services". An the important
>>> services for the company where I get a lot of experience about big
>>> amount of image reescaling is having the images available for the user
>>> today, just 2 seconds after the click, and not two weeks in the future,
>>> just one second after the click.
>>
>> Web sites don't go online in 5 minutes. You should know well ahead of
>> when the site goes "live" what resources are required, and plan to do
>> the resizing. But I also understand that's not possible when you're
>> flying by the seat of your pants.
>
> So you know beforehand which resources will actually be requested by
> your visitors? Do you also know the lottery numbers for next week?
>

I know what sizes of images are going to be needed, where they are
needed, and what I have to start with images. That's all I need to
provide the correct size for all images.

> With a million images there's a good chance that a lot of them will
> hardly be requested, if ever. I consider it a waste of server and
> network resources to pre-calculate and upload all of them at once.
> If there's a picture server - let it do the work as necessary.
>

"hardly be requested" is not the same as "never needed". And uploading
images is almost no load at all on a server; you could probably upload
10K pictures and not use as many server resources as resizing one image
(ftp is VERY resource unintensive!).

As for network resources - no, if your server is pushing 10mb/s or more,
then I wouldn't recommend doing it at that time. However, it doesn't do
it all the time. On the busy sites I've had, I know when the peaks are
and don't even touch the server at those times.

>>> If you think that doing resize on server is risky. Yes, it is. You have
>>> to dimensionate correctly your hardware, and do a good logic. But it can
>>> be done, it's done everyday by a lot of companies. I worked in one of
>>> them. I saw. And I could empirecally (exists this word?) test the way
>>> you explain and the way I explain. And the result in the real world, is
>>> that the little overhead of this last is insignificant compared with the
>>> benefits.
>>
>> In the "real world", people don't do unnecessary work on the server.
>
> Doesn't seem to happen here. Obviously the EC2 cloud does exactly what
> it is intended to do and paid for.
>

Yea, and if he resized the images offline he wouldn't need all that
power. As I told him - I have one VPS handling more hits than that per
day. And it's not even a full server. But it does use a lot of PHP and
MySQL (plus some perl).

>> And BTW - it's not just one user waiting - it's EVERYONE. You're taking
>> CPU resources, amongst other things, and there is a limit to what's
>> available. What it being taken by resizing is not available to anyone else.
>
> In a cloud environment CPU power is the least problem.
>

If he had a true cloud environment, that would be true. But it isn't.

>> Not a real problem when you have such a lightly loaded site as you do.
>> But I can see why you need all that power to serve so few hits.
>
> No paragraph of you without insults, directly or subtly. You can't live
> without that, right?
>

Just a fact. I can see why he needs all that power.

>>>> First of all, you shouldn't be waiting until the website is complete
>>>> before knowing what images you need to resize.
>>>
>>> This say nothing.
>>
>> This is called PLANNING.
>
> You can't plan your visitors.
>
> Micha
>

No, but I don't need to plan the visitors. I only need to plan the site.

--
==================
Remove the "x" from my email address
Jerry Stuckle
JDS Computer Training Corp.
jstucklex(at)attglobal(dot)net
==================

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